What Happens When You Stop Chasing Traffic and Start Building Trust [Endless Customers Podcast Ep. 149]

This transcript has been generated by AI and not checked for accuracy. 

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Adam Gardiner

one of the things that's so nice about working with impact and then those customers is they understand the sign of the times.

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Adam Gardiner

Right? It's bleeding edge of what's going on in this industry.

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Adam Gardiner

And now we're starting to have real traction against some of those massive competitors.

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Stephanie Baiocchi

You're listening to the Endless Customers podcast, brought to you by the team at IMPACT!

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Stephanie Baiocchi

Endless Customers is the proven system to become the most known and trusted brand in your market.

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Stephanie Baiocchi

If you want to learn the principles of Endless Customers and how you can implement them in your business, pick up a copy of Endless Customers, a national bestseller wherever books are sold.

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Stephanie Baiocchi

Ready to start implementing Endless Customers in your business? Talk to IMPACT about how our coaching program can help you implement Endless Customers to success.

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Stephanie Baiocchi

And if you want to experience Endless Customers in person, don't miss our upcoming event. Endless Customers Live in Hartford, Connecticut October 5th through the seventh, 2026. Registration is now open.

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Stephanie Baiocchi

And now on to the show.

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Stephanie Baiocchi

Here's your host, Bob Ruffolo.

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Bob Ruffolo

All right. So Bob Ross Flow, founder CEO of impact, here I am I'm running the podcast. You're probably saying, why is Bob hosting the podcast? Well, after about 150 episodes,

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Bob Ruffolo

Alex has done a phenomenal job.

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Bob Ruffolo

It's been a great team ever here at impact for many, many years.

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Bob Ruffolo

He's going to be moving on to fulfill his dream,

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Bob Ruffolo

of running his own company.

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Bob Ruffolo

We are incredibly, incredibly proud of him. In fact, if you are looking for video production work and you have some big creative jobs that need to be done, I would highly recommend that you reach out to Alex is always going to be friends of this, of this company.

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Bob Ruffolo

He's one of my best friends in the whole world.

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Bob Ruffolo

We've been very honored to have him here as part of our company.

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Bob Ruffolo

For for all these years, I believe it's been about seven years that we've had the opportunity to work together.

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Bob Ruffolo

So I moving forward, we'll be taking over the podcast. I have big shoes to fill, and, I'm very excited to do it. So with that, let's jump into our first episode here.

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Bob Ruffolo

Today's episode isn't about why most companies struggle with content. They struggle with alignment.

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Bob Ruffolo

Because you can have the right strategy, the right ideas, and even the right intent. Without clear ownership and the right people in the right seats, execution stalls.

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Bob Ruffolo

Joining us today are Dan Kerr and Adam Gardiner, co-founders of AdjusterPro, who made a series of intentional decisions to fix that.

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Bob Ruffolo

Instead of trying to spread responsibilities across the team, they committed to building the structure to support endless customers the right way. That meant hiring a dedicated videographer, identifying and transitioning internal team member into a content manager role, and creating real ownership around the system.

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Bob Ruffolo

In this conversation, we explore how they approach alignment. The role coaching played in guiding those decisions. What changed once those roles were in place and what they're seeing now as a result?

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Bob Ruffolo

Welcome, guys, to the podcast. We have our awesome guys from Adjuster Pro here today.

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Bob Ruffolo

And, for the audience, we'll start here really quickly. Just real quick. Tell us about AdjusterPro.

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Adam Gardiner

Dan, you want to start? Okay. Wait. We started in 2005, after successfully doing insurance claims adjusting and a catastrophe and realized that there was a need for training, you know, kind of real practical way. So we started in a garage with, cell phone, and, Dan learned HTML and did our SEO, and. Oh, it was just this wild ride.

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Adam Gardiner

We realized we needed to get online with our classes. We realized we needed to get every state so we could handle every state. And over the last, 20 plus years, we've grown into the largest insurance adjuster training company in the country. We've been 50, 50 business partners for, like, least 15, 18 years. And it's been a great partnership.

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Adam Gardiner

We've got a wonderful team. I don't need to name them all, but you guys know who you are, and really appreciate you. And, about 45 people were completely remote, and, we have been on, doing Endless customers impact thing for, gosh, it's got to be coming on about a year now.

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Bob Ruffolo

Yeah. So, Adam, so right before this, you were telling me, you're the one that discovered endless customers, and they said it would. It would work for Adjuster Pro. Is that correct?

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Adam Gardiner

Yes. Yeah. In fact, the way that I got that was kind of funny. Someone had turned me on to building a story brand.

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Bob Ruffolo

Okay.

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Adam Gardiner

Right.

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Bob Ruffolo

Which I realized those guys, by the way.

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Adam Gardiner

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well, that's the deal, is they told me about you guys, so I wanted to go deeper into that and wanted more training there. I still do, you know, it's great. And and we're using that. But I called them and the only coaching setup I could get with them was this little 15 minute, thing to try to get me to become a train.

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Adam Gardiner

The trainer. Yeah. And as soon as we met, I told the guy, look, you know, I, I don't want to do that, but I do want to learn more about how to do this. Yes. And as he was telling me about the different resources, he said, by the way, you need to check out this book. Endless Customers.

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Bob Ruffolo

Oh, I love that.

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Adam Gardiner

So I bought it right there and I started reading it and I'm like, mind blown, you know? And, I'll, I'll pass it off to Dan in a minute. But he was taking it, probably a ten, 12 hour drive to Mississippi. And I said, you should, you should check this out. And he said, yeah, I'll listen to it on the way down.

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Bob Ruffolo

Yeah. And,

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Bob Ruffolo

So just, connecting a story brand in, in this customer. So we actually, if going back to one of our past conferences, we actually had Donnell Miller and Marcus Sheridan on stage together talking about the two frameworks and how they they really work beautifully together. So when you had your message right then, Ellis customers is the system that bring that to the world so that really they really stack on top of each other beautifully.

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Bob Ruffolo

So, so Dan, so Adam passed you the book. You read it. And what what was it that you said? Okay, these frameworks, these principles, this system, I could see this working for AdjjusterPro. What was it?

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Dan Kerr

Well, the interesting thing and you know, if it's true, I took about a ten hour drive to Natchez, Mississippi, and I got through 75% of, endless customers audible. You know, I think it's by Marcus.

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Bob Ruffolo

So you're. Yeah. You listen to Marcus for for the whole time. Okay.

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Dan Kerr

Wow. Yeah. I listened to Marcus for nine hours straight. I was pretty amped up by the time I got pulled into Natchez. But, what's interesting is that the principles of endless customers, and they ask you to answer our principles that we really had been embracing instinctively from the very beginning. Now, Adam and I, in our 20 years together, we work together very closely for the first decade, and then we've been involved in other works in the past.

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Dan Kerr

Let's in the last decade, and we've really kind of come back just in the last year in a really focused and concerted way to work together here. And what feels like kind of the third, the third age of Adjuster Pro. Yeah. Which is which is pretty exciting. But the whole marketing program that we deployed initially was fundamentally about creating excellent content, giving it away.

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Dan Kerr

Yeah. Building trust, building credibility, becoming the most visible and credible, source. Within the industry. And so that's how we won at search engine optimization in the early days. And so when I was listening to endless customers, I thought, this is this is our approach. This is instinctively what we have been about all along. It's just that we had kind of fallen off the track a little bit in the last decade, and we were way behind in terms of technological adoption, with video and AI and the like.

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Dan Kerr

So we we've had a lot of work to do here in the last, nine months. I think it's been about nine months.

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Bob Ruffolo

So. So, Dan, let me ask you this. So why was it so important for you to be the leading educator in your space? So there's obviously a reason why you said or, you know, business reasons to do this, but why did you want to put yourself in that level? Because I think there's a lot of CEOs and executives out there say, hey, listen, we just got to get business, generate leads, give me leads, I'll get my sales team will close them.

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Bob Ruffolo

But you were for a long time thinking like, we have to position ourselves with trust and credibility. We have to win their hearts and their soul. So they they love us and they want to work with us. What? Why put that together for me a little bit?

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Dan Kerr

Well, I imagine there are a number of reasons, and some of them are reasons of principle. It just seems like it's the right way to do business. Yeah. You know, and I think that, it doesn't seem manipulative. It doesn't seem like we're cutting corners. It's not. It's it's an approach that I can sleep well at night with.

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Dan Kerr

And, and so just in principle, it's, it's an approach that I like. And then I also happen to think it is the most effective in getting business. So it's kind of a beautiful thing in that, it's the right way of doing it. It also happens to be, I think, the most effective. Yeah. And that was just borne out through experience of doing it in the early days and seeing what kind of impact it would have.

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Dan Kerr

With, you know, in both our B2C and our, in our B2B business, we really became the, the go to authority, within our industry for all kinds of things. The industry that we're in, there's a lot of, kind of labyrinthine and arcane information, very hard to put together. And so we took the trouble to kind of connect all those dots, which seemingly are unrelated, and to be able to then present that in a, hopefully an enjoyable format within an industry that's fairly dry.

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Dan Kerr

So the insurance industry. Yep. You know, those just seemed like great opportunities and that that certainly proved to be the case. Yeah.

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Bob Ruffolo

I mean, you're very, very forward thinking all that again, as people might be thinking, hey, I just need to generate deals, generate leads, generate business. And you're sitting here say, no, I'm going to earn their trust. I'm going to earn it. Really? Just I'm gonna make them fall in love with us. People do business with people. They do business with people they know, like, and trust.

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Bob Ruffolo

Even in sales, we talk about, when you have that level of authority, they already like you, they trust you, they prefer you deals just close. So much faster. And you were very forward thinking in saying, we're going to put ourselves in that position so that when they are reached out to us, they're not just looking at us as a vendor amongst other vendors.

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Bob Ruffolo

They're going to be like, I want to do business with a just a pro. I want to do business with Dan and Adam, and this is the company that's right for me. So I give you a lot of kudos for doing that.

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Dan Kerr

Yeah. Thanks. And you know, they're we are voracious readers here. So Adam and I just consume books. Yeah. And, you know, some of them aren't very good. And then every, Yeah, every so often you find some, some real, diamonds. And one of them was a book called UN marketing. I don't know if you're familiar with that.

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Bob Ruffolo

I actually don't know that one. No. Yeah, I don't know.

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Dan Kerr

I was probably 15 years old. I mean, we're kind of old.

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Bob Ruffolo

Right now. We're all the same age here. Probably.

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Dan Kerr

Yeah, that's probably about right. Adam actually is ancient. He just has found the fountain of youth. But Scott Stratton wrote a book called UN marketing, and it is a forerunner in a lot of ways to, the endless customers vision for precisely the things we're talking about. So I just want to tip my hat to that early book.

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Dan Kerr

But a lot of, you know, books, books have been our guide. Yeah. From early days.

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Bob Ruffolo

You know, it's so funny, as you're saying that, Dan, we often say here at impact that, you know, the tactics will change, the digital landscape will change. But the principle is don't the way people make buying decisions, the way people what they want to know before they are going to part with their money, you know, these things ever change.

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Bob Ruffolo

So I'm sure that that book today is just as relevant. The tactics might change in the bulk of it. Talk about, oh, you have to do this with, you know, SEO or things like that that might be different today than it is. You know, but the principles, if we hold on to those, it's it's amazing. 15 years later, I'm still your guiding light.

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Bob Ruffolo

So. So, Adam, I want to go back to you here. You had mentioned that the business has evolved and changed in a few different ways, and now you're in your third iteration and that. Then, Dan, you get to work together close again. So how do you guys guys divide up your responsibilities in the company.

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Adam Gardiner

Well that's actually pretty easy question to answer. And I'll toss that to Dan okay. If you want a little bit of history there.

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Bob Ruffolo

Yeah please.

00:12:32:22 - 00:13:01:13

Adam Gardiner

So Dan mentioned that we were out for a while and our leadership team was leading. All right. But there came a time when we needed to come back in, and, and one of the things that was a bit of a mess, there been some turnover in leadership as in regards to marketing. And so we found when we came back in especially, you know, I was the one who came back in first, beginning of 2025, we found marketing in, you know, demoralized, confused.

00:13:01:15 - 00:13:25:07

Adam Gardiner

Ineffective. Right. Even though we had good people. Yeah. So we didn't know what to do. In the, the the the landscape had changed completely. Right? So we're out. We're we're doing our own thing, and then we come back in and it's like, whoa, you know, what do we do here? And we needed a plan. We needed some kind of cohesive plan.

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Adam Gardiner

And that's when we discovered and lost customers. Now I started trying to implement that, but found I'm not a manager. All right? And that's where Dan, stepped in. And, you know, he was the one he called on that Mississippian trip, you know, and said, not only are we doing this, but we're going all in with coaching, and I'll toss it over to him from now.

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Dan Kerr

Yeah. So, you know, I guess if if there are titles, you know, Adam is the CVO, the chief visionary officer. You're familiar with iOS, I think.

00:14:02:01 - 00:14:03:11

Bob Ruffolo

Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

00:14:03:11 - 00:14:04:08

Dan Kerr

You speak that language.

00:14:04:08 - 00:14:06:14

Bob Ruffolo

You're talking to us as big as fanboy over here.

00:14:06:16 - 00:14:16:15

Dan Kerr

Yeah, we're pretty big fans as well. We've been we've been, in the iOS world since 2019, so for quite some time. That's great. But I mean.

00:14:16:16 - 00:14:25:09

Bob Ruffolo

We already know the value of working with an implementer and having somebody hold you accountable and, and make sure you're doing everything right and help you with your blind spots. It that all made sense to you.

00:14:25:11 - 00:14:37:00

Dan Kerr

Well, in fact, what I after I listened to, endless customers and I was having that first conversation with Adam, I said, Adam, this is iOS for sales and marketing.

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Bob Ruffolo

Exactly, exactly. That's a way we describe it. I love that.

00:14:40:16 - 00:14:58:20

Dan Kerr

And so and so we had seen a lot of, success with iOS. And just to have that kind of structure, to have that kind of accountability, to have that focus, you know, you can do a lot there are a lot of good things that can be done, but you can't do all of them at once. You've got to you've got to work through a process.

00:14:58:20 - 00:15:25:15

Dan Kerr

And so we needed that. And for me it was just a no brainer. So I, I've returned to Adjustor Pro, as the crew chief. Revenue officer. And that's, you know, currently the title I have in my one of my chief responsibilities is to be the, co implementer and kind of the integrator, if, as it were, for the customer's, vision here, with, with the company.

00:15:25:17 - 00:15:45:22

Bob Ruffolo

While you guys are doing it. Right. You absolutely are. And by the way, when you're talking about, your marketing team being a little bit lost in 2025, everything changed so fast. You were not alone. Even transparently behind the scenes here at impact, we. I mean, we teach the stuff in our own marketing team. We went through a very, very similar journey where I got back involved and we had a relook.

00:15:45:22 - 00:16:07:00

Bob Ruffolo

Our strategy and a lot of things that we were doing for years were was no longer working. We had to shake everything up. So it sounds like we're on a very similar journey at the same time, even though we teach the stuff and we know this stuff, but it's it's easier said than done sometimes I think that is the value of having somebody on the outside looking to refresh your eyes and and really just holding you guys accountable to make sure you're implementing step by step.

00:16:07:06 - 00:16:16:14

Bob Ruffolo

We actually had these coaches for ourselves, or we had our coaches working with our marketing team to make sure we were doing everything right the same way, using the same playbook cards. You use everything.

00:16:16:16 - 00:16:17:06

Dan Kerr

Yep.

00:16:17:08 - 00:16:36:15

Bob Ruffolo

Perfect. So okay, so here we are. We're going to do endless customers. We are all in on it. You we obviously you talked to our team. You hired the coaching. Hire your coaches. So talk about your first few months. What happened, what really worked? What what was the kickoff like for you?

00:16:36:17 - 00:17:01:03

Dan Kerr

as Adam alluded to, the the state of the marketing department, we had, you know, good, good people there, but there was a certain lack of, of direction and a certain lack of vision and, there and so it was it was, it was painful at first because it's about getting, you know, the right people in the right seats.

00:17:01:05 - 00:17:38:02

Dan Kerr

And so there was a lot of early evaluation of what that looked like and putting the team together. And so I feel like the first, you know, six weeks to, to two months was I felt like we were stuck in first gear, but the kind of painful work that we were doing, as I was getting reintegrated into the, the business and, learning a lot of new things myself, we were we were just sorting through a lot and doing a lot of assessment.

00:17:38:04 - 00:18:02:02

Dan Kerr

And that was helped tremendously by, our, our coaches at impact, not only in terms of discernment in understanding who's going to be a good fit and who might not be a good fit long term for the team. But just keeping, you know, being an encouraging voice and also, making sure we didn't get stuck for too long in any one area.

00:18:02:02 - 00:18:30:15

Dan Kerr

So, it was, it was a rocky beginning, just because of the state of our company. Yeah. But, we pushed through it, and by about month three, I would say we really started to, build some, you know, positive momentum, especially as we, found our content manager. That really changed things for us. But it took it three months.

00:18:30:17 - 00:18:37:20

Dan Kerr

It took us three months to land our content manager, and and, we really haven't looked back since.

00:18:37:22 - 00:18:56:16

Bob Ruffolo

We are absolutely going to get to that here in a second. But, I'm kind of reading between the lines here, so talk to me a little bit more. You were talking about getting the right people in the right seats. Now, of course, huge Jim Collins fan here. Right? First to get the right people in the right seats or get the right people on the bus, get the wrong people off the bus every day in the right seats and then figure out with busses going right,

00:18:56:16 - 00:18:59:07

Bob Ruffolo

did you have a lot of changes you had to make there?

00:18:59:07 - 00:19:02:11

Bob Ruffolo

I'm sure that was really difficult and challenging.

00:19:02:12 - 00:19:30:15

Dan Kerr

It is difficult. And and if we have, you know, I think one of our weaknesses as a, as a company and I'm sure this is true for a lot of companies is, we really love our people. And, we want to we very much want to make it work. Yeah. And will perhaps try to force that beyond, reasonable limits.

00:19:30:15 - 00:20:00:16

Dan Kerr

And so. Yeah, yeah, I think I think there were a couple of instances where, it wasn't the right person in the right seat and probably not the right person just as a cultural fit for us. Yeah. And and those things are always, difficult because these are people we like very much. But, the thing is, and I this isn't just related to the last nine months, but this is just in business in general.

00:20:00:18 - 00:20:28:10

Dan Kerr

You know, you make these hard decisions and you think they're going to be, catastrophic, perhaps for morale. And it almost always happens to be the opposite. It almost always happens to be a boost for the company, for sure. And and ironically, a relief for that team member who needs to go find a better opportunity somewhere else because they're it's just not the right fit for them.

00:20:28:12 - 00:20:35:00

Dan Kerr

And we find that time and time again. And so, that was that was the case. Yeah. In this instance, Adam.

00:20:35:02 - 00:21:06:02

Adam Gardiner

I might point out that, the the principles of endless customers became part of the, people analyzer. Right. Marketing side of things. So in the end, for one teammate that we we ended up, parting ways with, it was what finally did that was when we determined that they were not going to get on board with the customers plan, and this was the way that the bus was going.

00:21:06:03 - 00:21:06:20

Adam Gardiner

Right.

00:21:06:21 - 00:21:20:13

Bob Ruffolo

So, you know, people analyzer, you have your core values. And I could tell just by talking to you guys, I could probably guess what your core values are for us. One of ours is care, and it sounds like you probably have something that's probably very similar to care is one of your core values, you know, gets caught with.

00:21:20:13 - 00:21:21:09

Adam Gardiner

Respect for people.

00:21:21:09 - 00:21:38:20

Bob Ruffolo

You know, respect for people I love that. And then you have gets it wants it capacity to do it. And if if you don't want it wants a deal breaker, if somebody doesn't want to do the job, they can't have them see, they're never going to be motivated. They're going to be excited. And quite frankly, don't be scared to leave your company.

00:21:38:22 - 00:22:11:09

Bob Ruffolo

They might be maybe a little too lazy to go and look for that next opportunity or whatever it is. It might be a million reasons why someone's not leaving, but it's the best thing for them to go find a job that they do want to do, and they will care about and they will feel fulfilled. And quite frankly, maybe a job where they can make more money and grow in advance and provide more for their family, and it gives you the opportunity to get somebody in that seat who is the perfect person for that role, and they can grow with you and grow your company with you.

00:22:11:11 - 00:22:25:11

Bob Ruffolo

So I think, you know, you guys both said spot on. It's how important it is to have the right people in the right seats doing the right jobs. Right? And helping you bring that bus to where it needs to go. So, give you guys, give you guys a lot of credit for that because that's a very difficult thing to do.

00:22:25:13 - 00:22:42:18

Bob Ruffolo

And we've been there too. I think as business owners, you guys have been around for for over 20 years now, right? Yeah. So you've seen a thing or two and, you know, we're we're going on 17 years here. So I can totally empathize with you. I'm sure our audience can empathize with you as well, but here we are now we've got the right person in the seat.

00:22:42:21 - 00:22:44:09

Bob Ruffolo

How do we get there?

00:22:44:11 - 00:23:13:08

Dan Kerr

Well, interestingly, we thought we would have to cast a very broad net, to find our content manager. And it turns out our content manager was right under our nose, working in a different department. Yeah. And when we put out an internal memo, about this position, and an external memo, we were we were broadcasting it, but, we had a couple of people throw their hat in the ring.

00:23:13:10 - 00:23:54:13

Dan Kerr

Within the team. And one of one of those, team members was, a gal who was in the, on the product development team, and she was a writer working as a writer in, quality control there. And, so she, submitted her application, and, very quickly, we were, delighted and surprised to see all these kinds of, serendipitous credentials that she had, and was bringing to the table.

00:23:54:15 - 00:24:14:21

Dan Kerr

And the great thing is, she'd already been screened, you know, as a good culture fit for us. And on top of that, she had a pretty good understanding of some of the inner workings of our product. And the in our in, in the way that that product was put together. So she had a, a running start, there.

00:24:14:21 - 00:24:37:14

Dan Kerr

And so anyway, impact was I, I thought our coaches were key because we had some, we had a couple of good candidates, a couple really good internal candidates. That's great. And impact was, especially helpful, the coaches in helping us vet those and come up with our, you know, our final choice.

00:24:37:16 - 00:24:54:11

Bob Ruffolo

Can you talk more about that process and what what did they walk you through? I kind of know, but I want to hear from your own words. What were what were some of the tools that they use and what was the process that they went through that made you say, okay, we actually do have someone that here's would be perfect for the role.

00:24:54:13 - 00:25:28:16

Dan Kerr

Yeah. You know, that was that's one of the things I'm thankful for already. And working with impact is you guys have shown us, I think, a better way, to conduct, vetting in the hiring process because your the it's a very demanding process. That impact has there's you've got to provide work examples kind of you're given assignments so it's not as simple as hey submit your resume and then we'll have kind of a nice little 20 minute chat and we'll get back to you.

00:25:28:18 - 00:25:52:17

Dan Kerr

It was much more structured, much more rigorous, much more demanding of the candidate. And so a lot of the candidates just sort of, self, you know, they. Yeah, if they're not really motivated for it and genuinely interested, they're not even going to go through the process because it's a significant process and it requires some work output.

00:25:52:19 - 00:26:15:12

Dan Kerr

And that's not just for content manager best for the videographer as well. So they really have to reduce. They have to produce something that then gets reviewed and scrutinized. And and so that was that was just tremendous. And seeing how you all did that and then the way the interviews were conducted, pretty no nonsense. We're we're kind of we're kind of softies over here.

00:26:15:12 - 00:26:36:23

Dan Kerr

We're kind of we're a little bit more on the, kind of the casual, friendly side, but, one of your coaches, you know, is, was, pretty laser focused on that, in that process. And that was a great thing to see. Super helpful. And Brett gave us a lot of confidence that we were making the right choice.

00:26:37:00 - 00:26:55:13

Bob Ruffolo

Yeah. So and for the listeners here, so the process that you guys went through, is very much based on top grading. And if you want to learn more about top rating, the book who by Jeff Smart I would highly recommend is one of my favorite books. So that's how we crafted it. And we do a screening round because we believe that you want to see as many can.

00:26:55:15 - 00:27:27:07

Bob Ruffolo

You possibly can, if you could do a video round interview. So you could screen as many, content managers or applicants as you possibly can. And then we have some interviews. But the real key to that is there are two things is you have the job scorecard, and that is just black and white. They can either do the job or they can't because the job scorecard is in place and it's you're evaluating and you're asking questions around everything in that scorecard, to make sure that we have an A player here or we're going to have a see, we're going to have somebody that can come in and do the job probably right

00:27:27:07 - 00:27:44:04

Bob Ruffolo

away, or we're gonna have some. It's gonna be a lot of training and development. So that's what that's for. And then we just validate that with a situation activity where you actually get to see the real work product and you get to see, how they would thrive and how they to your point, how motivated would be to go a little bit above and beyond?

00:27:44:06 - 00:28:04:08

Bob Ruffolo

And we have this whole process all laid out. The playbook exists in impact plus, which will soon be renamed to the This Customer Academy spoiler here. So anyone that is interested in, learning how to hire and onboard a content manager, we have the whole playbook laid out similar to what you guys went through as well.

00:28:04:10 - 00:28:16:17

Bob Ruffolo

So so that's great. Now you have this candidate or you had this person, you're on your team, they checked off all the boxes, got the sign off from the coaches. And so tell me what happened next. So, so this person is off to the races.

00:28:16:19 - 00:28:23:05

Adam Gardiner

There was a little bit of a funny story there. Oh, let's go ahead. We had two really good internal candidates.

00:28:23:05 - 00:28:24:06

Bob Ruffolo

Okay.

00:28:24:08 - 00:28:48:22

Adam Gardiner

And as we were choosing one, the other one was actually the one receiving the emails about the selection. Right. So she saw that we were choosing the other person, but we liked her so much. We had another role for her in the team. So now we work with her on a on a, you know, weekly basis. And she's an integral part of the team.

00:28:48:22 - 00:28:53:11

Adam Gardiner

It was great. But it did it did get a little messy. Hiring from the inside.

00:28:53:16 - 00:29:07:04

Bob Ruffolo

Oh, no. Yeah. So. Okay, so you saw the emails. It's funny. Now, she was already. So both those cans were already in house, and they both wanted to move into a content management role. And you happened to have another position? Was it on your training side?

00:29:07:06 - 00:29:18:00

Adam Gardiner

No. We needed, we needed someone on the, more technical side, you know, doing stuff on the website and creating marketing materials for us. And she does a great job with that.

00:29:18:02 - 00:29:42:22

Bob Ruffolo

Oh, amazing. Oh that's great. So, you know, as we start building out marketing teams, as we look in-house, as you guys know, there's two core positions. Everyone doing analyst customers. We push these two positions. Even in the AI first world, always at least the content manager start there. The second position is almost always a videographer. But as we've seen teams grow, I would say the most common size teams are between 3 and 5 people.

00:29:43:00 - 00:30:02:20

Bob Ruffolo

And then those roles really much vary. But you know, we've seen companies have two content managers or maybe even three because it's so important that they want to be the most known, trusted and recommended company in their market. Just understanding how important content is. So, glad you were able to have another role in and find a spot for that's great.

00:30:02:22 - 00:30:23:07

Bob Ruffolo

So, so let's talk more about your kicking off now. As everyone here probably knows, we kick off, endless customers with what's, what's called alignment day. And you guys had an alignment day, at your business. Correct. So we did perfect. So alignment day is really two parts. We make sure one, we get everybody on the same page.

00:30:23:13 - 00:30:39:21

Bob Ruffolo

So we do a full company training. A lot of people ask like, do I have to have my content manager in place to do the alignment training? And honestly, the answer is no because it's not really for the marketing team. The marketing team reads the book like you guys do. They say it makes so much sense. We should.

00:30:39:22 - 00:30:57:20

Bob Ruffolo

Why? Why haven't we been doing this for so long? But the real reason why, unless customers really fails before it starts, is internal resistance, especially from the sales team, from other leaders say we can't possibly be talking about these things. We can't do this on the website. I'm not going to be on camera. And then everything just fails, right?

00:30:57:22 - 00:31:14:18

Bob Ruffolo

So so the alignment day training is why we do that. And then we do our planning session to make sure that we have a plan for the first 90 days, our roadmap to make sure we're doing everything we're supposed to be doing. So by the time 90 days in, we're exactly where we need to be. So talk to me about getting ready for your alignment day.

00:31:14:18 - 00:31:21:09

Bob Ruffolo

What did you guys experience? Having that training for, for everybody. And did you guys do that in person?

00:31:21:14 - 00:31:46:14

Adam Gardiner

I have the opinion that, the alignment was a bit clunky. And the reason why, in my opinion, is that the company had been was in the process of going through a real crucible. And I think personally, there was a bit of fatigue from the whole company about hearing, oh, we're going to do this or we're going to do that.

00:31:46:14 - 00:31:56:16

Adam Gardiner

And, and I, I suspect there was this attitude of, oh, great, here's another thing that, you know, Adam and Dan of, you know, coming to talk to.

00:31:56:20 - 00:32:06:23

Bob Ruffolo

Come in directly from you guys. So they're so used to hearing from you over and over again. It's like, all right. So these guys are here's another idea to write another book this weekend.

00:32:07:00 - 00:32:48:16

Adam Gardiner

That kind of thing. Right. So, you know, we've been down that road before. We had a few marketing managers. It didn't work out so well. And so I think there was some skepticism in the beginning, and there was a lot of, negative inertia to overcome. So, so while I want to say that I believe the, alignment day and the implementation was clunky, if it hadn't been for continuous coaching, I think it would be that the the, team would have been right, that we would have petered out and, would have been another initiative that was just a great idea that didn't, take place.

00:32:48:18 - 00:33:06:01

Bob Ruffolo

And you're not you're not alone in that. So sometimes it's the first time they hear it, it's like, all right, into your plans and, but it's repetition and sometimes people have to hear things seven, eight, ten times here for the first time, for things to actually think and be like, wait, this actually does make sense. This is the way I buy.

00:33:06:05 - 00:33:10:00

Bob Ruffolo

This is how we should market, because that's probably the way our buyers would buy.

00:33:10:02 - 00:33:25:11

Bob Ruffolo

So. So I hear you on that. And sometimes, you know, there's also another reason why we recommend Alignment Day at least once a year. Because your businesses continue to change and evolve. You can have new people coming in and and you to have some people leaving and you going to have your business is going to evolve and you're basically in much different spot.

00:33:25:11 - 00:33:43:12

Bob Ruffolo

The digital landscape will be different by the time you do it. So every year just make sure we bring that back to the to the team. And everyone's now here and the second time and everybody's in a different spot when they hear it the second or third time. So it makes a lot of sense. And Dan, how about from your perspective on kicking off and doing alignment?

00:33:43:12 - 00:33:44:13

Bob Ruffolo

Dan.

00:33:44:15 - 00:33:55:10

Dan Kerr

Yeah, I think Karen's right there was, kind of, skepticism about, a new direction, right?

00:33:55:12 - 00:34:04:01

Dan Kerr

As I said, it really wasn't a new direction. It was it was the old direction. It was the old way. But we were bringing it back and,

00:34:04:03 - 00:34:07:04

Bob Ruffolo

With some new terms and some new, you know, vernacular, I'm sure.

00:34:07:04 - 00:34:36:13

Dan Kerr

Exactly, exactly. The the lexicon was a little bit different. The, the technology we were going to bring to bear on it was obviously far more advanced, but the principles were the same. But again, I think what it seemed like, what it represented to a lot not all, but to to many was, just, another kind of, shiny, you know, shiny object that we were that we were, going to pursue.

00:34:36:15 - 00:34:41:08

Dan Kerr

And when I say we, I don't just mean out of an eye. Although we are,

00:34:41:10 - 00:34:42:22

Adam Gardiner

As any object kings.

00:34:43:02 - 00:35:12:11

Dan Kerr

Yeah, well, I mean, as as we both have kind of the, the entrepreneurial energy for, you know, constant never ending improvement. And so we're always looking to, we're always kind of looking around the corner, what's coming and what we can do better and improve on. So but the, the, the marketing and sales department had been, without clear direction and consistent direction for several years.

00:35:12:13 - 00:35:24:16

Dan Kerr

And so it just seemed like the next kind of thing, the next fad. Yeah. And, and so there was quite a bit of inertia to overcome. And I think Adam's right that the,

00:35:24:18 - 00:35:39:04

Dan Kerr

the coaches really helped us to, bear down on that and to, persevere through some of that initial resistance, and, and get through to the other side.

00:35:39:06 - 00:36:03:23

Dan Kerr

And, you know, a lot of, a lot of what won the, the team here at Adjustor Pro over was, seeing some of the, you know, the fruit, which you really, really only becomes visible once you get your content manager and your videographer in place, and they really start producing some content that you can get excited about that you see, is moving the needle that you see is helping your customers.

00:36:04:01 - 00:36:13:10

Dan Kerr

And so once that starts happening, it's it's, it's it's not a hard sell anymore at all.

00:36:13:12 - 00:36:34:09

Bob Ruffolo

You know, you're, you're speaking to and I want to hear more about that fruit. But you're speaking to exactly what most of our audience goes through is, is that gain that buy in from their teams, and everyone's got that shiny object syndrome. And so you really, the fact that you guys are sticking with and by the way, you guys are, I believe are nine and a half months, I just looked nine and a half months through your journey.

00:36:34:09 - 00:36:52:08

Bob Ruffolo

I think you have your next planning session coming up so severe. Leave your third planning session so you know, and speaking in the, iOS terms, you know, having this live on your VTL on the first page is part of our vision. This is how we're going to market. This is how we're going to be perceived. And we're going to be a leader when it comes to endless customers.

00:36:52:08 - 00:37:07:19

Bob Ruffolo

Even putting those words on there as a message you can send to your entire company in the first time you put on your VTL Mac. All right, well, that's to change. Next time they they update the video, but once they're quarter after quarter after quarter, come out of your annuals and it's still on there. And then every quarter you have rocks.

00:37:07:23 - 00:37:33:13

Bob Ruffolo

And every time that you come out of a quarterly and there's rocks around, what we're doing down with customers and the next focus areas we have down those customers, we keep marching forward, comes more real. I've seen that in our own business, too. Well, when we keep our VTL very consistent, people start taking more seriously. And then when we have every time we have rocks, it just continues to build towards our one year plan or three year picture, all that stuff.

00:37:33:15 - 00:37:48:01

Bob Ruffolo

And that's how you get more by. And so for the audience, if you're struggling with that's a, that's a, that's direction going, and you guys very, very wisely are doing a beautiful job with that. So, I do want to hear about the videographer. I do want but before we even do that I want to hear the fruit.

00:37:48:03 - 00:38:07:09

Bob Ruffolo

So what's been what have you guys say again? Early nine and a half months in. Anyone in here that's done, any systems like iOS or anything like that? These things don't happen overnight. They take time because you're changing our culture. You're putting systems in place, putting processes in place, and it's a long term gain. It's going to add business value.

00:38:07:11 - 00:38:12:11

Bob Ruffolo

But what are you but you see wins along the way. So what have you guys seen in the in your first nine and a half months.

00:38:12:13 - 00:38:49:23

Dan Kerr

Well, you know that we've seen a lot and a lot of it is, is, cultural shift. Yeah. Right. And I think that's the most important thing, in this early time frame is, a kind of shift in our imagination and how we see ourselves and how we see ourselves in relationship to the market and to our customers and and seeing ourselves as, storytellers and, and also seeing ourselves as, as a media, a media company.

00:38:50:04 - 00:39:26:03

Dan Kerr

And we, I think had, for a variety of reasons, had strayed from being a, having a customer first mentality and really, having that kind of connection, to our customers. So, so one of the things that I've been very pleased about, you know, especially in, let's say, the last three months, is we as a sales and marketing department, first of all, those departments were absolute silos nine months ago, and that is not the case today.

00:39:26:05 - 00:39:31:08

Dan Kerr

That's huge. Quarter for, you know, within the culture of the company.

00:39:31:10 - 00:39:37:22

Bob Ruffolo

And when you say they're no longer silos, what are they doing differently now that they weren't doing two, nine months ago?

00:39:37:23 - 00:40:03:15

Dan Kerr

Well, just how about some how about some basic communication? Yeah. You know, some, a little bit of esprit de corps, a little sense of, we're in this thing together. And, if we do our job, it's going to be easier for you to do your job. Yeah. And there's a kind of collaborative spirit now, and just mutual goodwill between marketing and sales.

00:40:03:17 - 00:40:33:23

Dan Kerr

That honestly didn't exist before. We we got started. So there's been a kind of reframing there, which has been very, very helpful. But our, we have a real good finger on the pulse of the industry right now and are far more responsive to what, what our potential customers are actually concerned about, what questions they're actually answering or actually asking.

00:40:34:01 - 00:41:06:09

Dan Kerr

And so we've shifted in the production of our content, both written and video, from the things that we kind of want to talk about to really focusing on what questions are being asked and how can we very candidly, answer those questions. So that's enormous. Yeah, right. That's a huge shift. And, and, and that just bodes so well for the future for, for us.

00:41:06:12 - 00:41:06:20

Dan Kerr

Yeah.

00:41:07:00 - 00:41:31:06

Bob Ruffolo

Yeah. Because you can't build a skyscraper on a, rocky foundation. So. And the culture is the foundation. Having marketing and sales teams that are working as a unified revenue team is a solid foundation. Having salespeople are willing to be in front of a camera. Being interviewed is a giant when having content that is not fluffy or safe, but actually addresses the things that real buyers care about and getting that published.

00:41:31:06 - 00:41:45:18

Bob Ruffolo

And, talk about things that might be uncomfortable, but you're to the audience are saying, finally, somebody is addressing this, somebody saying the things that that no one's been willing to say in our space. And then using that in sales to close deals faster.

00:41:45:20 - 00:42:08:10

Dan Kerr

Yeah. No, it's great because, you know, we we shied away from what would be, I suppose, potentially controversial sort of subjects like comparing us versus one of our competitors and just sort of explicitly taking on that question. Yeah. The form of a video or an article.

00:42:08:12 - 00:42:23:03

Bob Ruffolo

And that doesn't mean talking down by your competitors, but, you know, the you are not the same as your competitors. They've made decisions to do one thing. You made decisions, do a different thing, and somebody just wants to know, how are these two companies different? Tell me and you're doing it right.

00:42:23:03 - 00:42:48:06

Dan Kerr

And even if, even if, the assessment, you know, if the skills or even, let's say we, we go beyond and we give perhaps more credit than even as due to our competitor, in the skills come out 5050 in the article. Yeah. We're in the mind of the customer. Is the trust going to go towards let's kind of go towards our brand right.

00:42:48:08 - 00:43:11:10

Dan Kerr

So I love that, you know, and I love, I love disruptive, content like that, that, just it's, it's the things that people are thinking, maybe not saying, but, are absolutely thinking. And so we're just addressing some of those questions head on. So that's been great.

00:43:11:12 - 00:43:26:23

Bob Ruffolo

That's great. Yeah. Well, you're speaking to an album company. But what you're speaking to is you're not trying to win every possible deal that's out there. You're trying to win the the deals that are your ideal customers, that are the right fit for you. They're going to be long term great clients for you,

00:43:27:03 - 00:43:43:11

Bob Ruffolo

The more you bring on big carriers and you earn their trust, and you might not want to work with every single one of them, but you want the ones that are right for you. And, and maybe, your competitors, right. For somebody else. And you're helping them steer to the right company for them earning that trust and all the reputation that goes along with that.

00:43:43:16 - 00:43:46:05

Bob Ruffolo

Adam. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to cut you off there before.

00:43:46:07 - 00:43:51:12

Adam Gardiner

No, not at all. And you're absolutely right. We want to steer all the jerks over to that.

00:43:51:14 - 00:43:53:03

Bob Ruffolo

They can have them all.

00:43:53:04 - 00:44:06:23

Adam Gardiner

We've been dedicated to, win, win, win. We call them arrangements for a long time. It's got to be win for us. It's got to be win for our partner. It's got to be win for the customers we serve, you know? Right. But I just want to say that when I came back, I came back in first.

00:44:06:23 - 00:44:25:06

Adam Gardiner

And I'm trying to work with the marketing team, and I see that our traffic is just going down, down, down, down, down. And I start like, we had some big competitors move into our space, right? We get this insurance adjuster training, but we've got some competitors insurance adjuster training. They add that and it's just like a teeny little piece to them.

00:44:25:12 - 00:44:50:20

Adam Gardiner

Right? But they got a huge wallet and a huge marketing budget. They've got thousands of backlinks. And I'm scratching my head and yelling at the team. You know, you guys we got it. We got to get backlinks. We got to get our traffic back and nobody knows what to do. Yeah. Right. So so, understanding one of the things that's so nice about working with impact and then those customers is they understand the sign of the times.

00:44:50:22 - 00:45:13:02

Adam Gardiner

Right? It's bleeding edge of what's going on in this industry. So we started for focusing on stuff like artificial intelligence and what artificial intelligence needs to know. That's right. And so we're writing articles. We're doing videos. And now we're starting to have real traction against some of those massive competitors. Right. That we had no idea how to even compete with.

00:45:13:02 - 00:45:20:15

Adam Gardiner

Because if we got any three back rank links and they got 2008 and, you know, 32, what are you going to do? Yeah. Right.

00:45:20:17 - 00:45:39:18

Bob Ruffolo

So that's I give a lot of credit to Marcus. Marcus Sheridan, he's always been a forward when it comes to all these things. And he, he saw this stuff 2 or 3 years ago. And I think we're very blessed to be able to be able to follow him. But if you are trying to get your website traffic back, you're barking up the wrong tree.

00:45:39:20 - 00:46:02:20

Bob Ruffolo

That is not what businesses should be doing today. Businesses today should be building their brands. So whenever a customer in their space and this has been a principle, if they ask you the answer, the previous book to the Endless Customers ten years ago, is whenever a customer has a fear worry issue, concern, they think of you, they trust you, they want to know what you think about it.

00:46:02:20 - 00:46:20:20

Bob Ruffolo

They want you answering their question more than anyone else. And that hasn't changed in the age of AI. Now, the tools we use, we're not going to Google, but we're going to AI. And AI is not going to serve as much traffic to our website, but we build our brands on other platforms that we build it on YouTube, we build it on social media, we build it wherever our customers are.

00:46:20:22 - 00:46:39:14

Bob Ruffolo

As long as we are winning the mindshare and when they think of any issue that they have and they think of us first, then that's more winning and they only want to do business with us. And that's different. And they also hard to measure. But that's where the world is going. And and we're leaning into that. So really really nice job.

00:46:39:19 - 00:46:46:21

Bob Ruffolo

Now before we wrap up, you guys are also on the journey for bringing a videographer on or you have already, fill that role.

00:46:46:23 - 00:46:53:04

Dan Kerr

We have. Yeah. No, we have a videographer who's been with us for, for three and a half months now.

00:46:53:04 - 00:47:04:01

Bob Ruffolo

Okay, perfect. And, and so very similar process, I have to imagine to, bring the videographer on as to the hiring process for the content manager 100%.

00:47:04:01 - 00:47:29:21

Dan Kerr

And, the cool thing is, you know, with the with the process, our videographer candidates have to produce their own videos specific to the candidacy. And for this position at Adjuster Pro. And so, you know, we we had some really interesting submissions there. Yeah. And, the guy who ended up getting the getting the position, Josh, just created a terrific video.

00:47:29:21 - 00:47:32:17

Dan Kerr

And I think when all of us saw it, we thought, this is our guy.

00:47:32:21 - 00:47:54:10

Bob Ruffolo

Yeah, you'll know when you know, right? Yeah. And, you know, for many of many businesses and especially I'm out there speaking, I'm talking to audiences. It's a lot for people to to bite off, to say I'm going to bring on a content manager. I'm also bringing a video for, I could probably just outsource the stuff, but you guys have seen through that.

00:47:54:12 - 00:48:16:06

Bob Ruffolo

And then you bring on a coach and it's it's a significant investment. But why again, you talked about the coaching before and you drew parallels to having an iOS implementer. But even bringing the two positions in-house, it's it's not the easiest thing for businesses to do. But what why would you what would you say to another business owner who's saying should I do that.

00:48:16:08 - 00:48:27:03

Adam Gardiner

I suppose it would. This would depend on their business culture. But I think for most folks that are, busy executives, like we are,

00:48:27:06 - 00:48:36:22

Adam Gardiner

you can see it's a great idea, right? You can have all the intention in the world, but you've got a bunch of initiatives. I mean, we've got fires on a lot of different fronts.

00:48:37:00 - 00:49:00:14

Adam Gardiner

We're growing. We're a growing business. And just to have that, you know, return again and again to, okay, where are you? Where are you? We've got these 23 initiatives, right? From what I'm seeing, you've only done eight, right? That is so helpful. It keeps us focused and refocused again on, one of the most essential, aspects of our business.

00:49:00:18 - 00:49:08:09

Adam Gardiner

I did I was always told the business breaks down into get work, do work, keep score, and if you don't get work, yeah, the whole machine breaks down.

00:49:08:10 - 00:49:09:19

Bob Ruffolo

Yeah, yeah.

00:49:09:21 - 00:49:46:03

Dan Kerr

Yeah. As far as bringing those two positions in-house, for us, it is, I think, a cultural, priority for us to have the key spokesmen, the key representatives for our brand, really represent us in our tone and and really who we are. And I'm just not comfortable with hiring that out to somebody who is representing multiple brands in multiple cultures.

00:49:46:04 - 00:50:09:00

Dan Kerr

I really want I really want it to be, unique to us. I think that gives us a real edge. And, and then the kind of productivity that we are looking for right now, requires two full time people, you know? Yeah. And so, the return on investment to me is it's just, it's a no.

00:50:09:00 - 00:50:28:10

Bob Ruffolo

Brainer. Yeah, yeah, for sure. And by the way, Adam, I really like that. I never heard that, get work, do work, keep score. It's that's like the three areas of business, right? Sales and marketing, operations, accounting. Right. I love that, it makes a lot of sense. And obviously, we we push in-house so much because they work alongside your team.

00:50:28:10 - 00:50:45:09

Bob Ruffolo

They get to know you guys. They get to know the business, the culture, the history, a level that only employees get when they work inside of a business, when they're splitting their time working month, then then you guys just become a job for them, right? And they just want to get done, get paid versus actually helping the company do things.

00:50:45:11 - 00:51:03:07

Bob Ruffolo

Your content manager is going to put out hundreds of pieces of content per year. Let's and get in the hands of the sales team to help them close deals faster than your videographers can do the same thing hundreds of videos a year, running your YouTube channel, optimizing a it, and going back to your videos and going back to this content and making sure it's optimized and performing at the highest level.

00:51:03:09 - 00:51:22:14

Bob Ruffolo

That's something that most outsource companies just don't do. So you had the right pieces in place. You guys have the right mindset. You have. You built the culture, right. Your foundation strong. I am very, very much looking forward to, have you guys back on the show here in 9 to 12 months because you guys are gonna be a, totally different spot.

00:51:22:16 - 00:51:42:18

Bob Ruffolo

You're doing all the right things. We are very blessed to have clients just like you, because this is what it takes to to really get to endless customers and become the most known trust and recommended company in your market. You're doing all the right things. So, before we wrap up, is there anything else that we missed that you want to share to the audience?

00:51:42:20 - 00:51:52:01

Dan Kerr

Well, one thing I would share is, is just how, meaningful and valuable the conference was to us.

00:51:52:05 - 00:51:52:23

Bob Ruffolo

Okay, cool.

00:51:53:04 - 00:52:31:03

Dan Kerr

So I brought three of our team members to the conference in Chicago, and my expectations were genuinely surpassed. I, you know, I, I have mixed feelings about conferences in terms of their value. And, that was an incredibly valuable two and a half days. It kind of a refresher the a full day of going over the principles again, but then seeing other companies and what they're doing and how they're implementing these principles, gives you a lot of, ideas.

00:52:31:03 - 00:52:48:10

Dan Kerr

It gives you a lot of confidence. It gives the competitive juices flowing. You think, dang it, I'm on a beat, I won. We're entering in this contest next year for, you know, being the, you know, showing what others won't show or, you know, there's there's different awards for awards.

00:52:48:10 - 00:52:49:03

Bob Ruffolo

Yeah.

00:52:49:05 - 00:53:18:18

Dan Kerr

Yeah. And then and then the last day with you and Marcus and, you had another guest speaker, Kevin. That was especially valuable. And so to know that the thought leaders within the industry and, I mean, the 1% of the 1% are at the helm of this organization that were partnered with, gave just gives me a lot of confidence.

00:53:18:18 - 00:53:36:12

Dan Kerr

And I think, okay, we've hitched our our wagon to the right horses here and it was just, so for anybody who, who has an opportunity or is thinking about that conference, 100% would recommend attending it. And that comes from a person who doesn't tend to like conferences. So.

00:53:36:14 - 00:53:51:01

Bob Ruffolo

Yeah, I mean, it means a lot. Thank you so much. It was so great having you on your team there. And no doubt, will you guys win one of the awards? In the very near future? I hope you apply for all of them. And, but really, and I'm part of the community that's the judge who wins the awards.

00:53:51:02 - 00:54:10:23

Bob Ruffolo

Just the biggest thing I can say is like, do that stuff that makes your company a little bit uncomfortable, but solves for your customer. And and that's what your customers want. And, and because that, that they're going to do things with your business that, that otherwise it wouldn't have done. Right. So, go, go, go for it. Disrupt your industry.

00:54:10:23 - 00:54:34:03

Bob Ruffolo

Do something really bold. Do something bold. Yeah. And, you know, we do this, these conferences every six months. We do them because the, this environment is changing so rapidly that that last day, what we did in, in Chicago will be obsolete when when we're, you know, Hartford comes up in October. So, you know, that's the hardest part is figuring out, okay, how are we going to push the boundaries again and again?

00:54:34:03 - 00:54:50:15

Bob Ruffolo

Luckily I have Markus that that really pushes us forward there. So great. Well guys, you're doing all the right things. We're so proud of you. We'll be back here. Hopefully, we'll tell, you know, you guys are winning an award. We'll we'll do an episode around that. But if nothing else, we're going to talk about your entire journey in just a few months.

00:54:50:21 - 00:54:54:01

Bob Ruffolo

Congratulations on everything. And we'll talk to you soon. Thanks very.

00:54:54:03 - 00:54:54:15

Adam Gardiner

A lot of fun.